How Revolution Design Reached $240K Revenue with 4 Customers in 2023 (Interview with CEO Kerim Al-Lami)

Introduction and Company Overview

Nathan Latka

00:00Revolution dot design is trying to help you get design done faster and more affordably in a more reliable way. They've got four customers, say, paying $5 a month launch just eight months ago, already doing 20,000 a month in revenue. Again, this is sort of that blend between a design agency plus recurring SaaS fee, hoping to keep these customers sticky. We usually see a lot of churn. They haven't lost any customers so far. Only four. They haven't

00:20lost any of them, which is good. We'll see what happens next. Hey, folks. My guest today is Kerim Al-Lami. He helps tech startups avoid complicated in house hiring, overpriced design agencies, and unreliable freelancers with his company. It's called revolution design. They can hire top 1% senior design talent in one day for $49.90 per month. That's almost 5,000 a month. And pause or cancel at any time. Kerim, are you ready to take us to the top? Yes.

Addressing Churn in Design Subscriptions

Nathan Latka

00:46Let's go. Alright. This is cool. So so I've interviewed a bunch of folks that do this sort of thing, and the issue is always churn. It's keeping someone paying $5 a month for more than a couple months. How do you address this?

Kerim Al-Lami

00:57>> Yeah. Basically, I think the main thing to address here is to hire the best designers, really, like, you know, prove your point. Because when the client is happy with you and all of the designs, they get them quickly, they are happy with them, I think they will stay. You know, we've been in the business for quite a not very long time. We've been in the business for eight months. And, you know, some of our clients are

01:22>> still with us after eight months. So, yeah, I think that's like the main point to address always.

Nathan Latka

01:27That's great. Okay. So you launched eight months. So you launched basically January 2020 this year?

Kerim Al-Lami

01:33>> Yep. Yes. Yes. Yes.

Nathan Latka

01:34Very cool. Okay. And can you give me an example of a customer paying you today?

Kerim Al-Lami

01:39>> Yes. So usually there are tech startups who just raised a series A or seat or anything like that, and they are looking for designers. Usually, the founder is quite technical or like the marketing person is quite, you know, marketing and they are not skilled in looking for designers, looking at portfolios and stuff like that. And, you know, they have like three options, you know, hire agency, full time, or freelancer. And, you know, they are all, like,

Customer Profile and Target Market

Kerim Al-Lami

02:11>> kind of fundamentally flawed in our view.

Nathan Latka

02:13So how many designers have have I mean, do you hire them full time or do you is it a marketplace? You just sit in between?

Business Model and Team Structure

Kerim Al-Lami

02:20>> Yeah. Basically, we sit in between and we are like the creative directors. I have also a co founder. We've been freelancing and helping tech startups for almost combined period of fifteen years. So we know like we know how it goes, especially in this industry. And we kind of seen in between as creative directors and, you know, direct the the designers and communicate with clients and stuff like that.

Number of Paying Customers

Nathan Latka

02:43And So how many how many paying customers then do you have today?

Kerim Al-Lami

02:47>> Yeah. Right now we have four.

Nathan Latka

02:49Okay. Yeah. One And how many freelance designers do you need to support those four paying customers?

Designer Capacity and Czech Republic Talent

Kerim Al-Lami

02:55>> So actually, one designer can take up to three clients. And, you know, like the main thing why we kind of founded revolution design is because here in Czech Republic and Slovakia where we are from, you know, we have like a really great design talent for really affordable prices. And, you know, that's the reason why one of the biggest agency design agency is called STRV, is basically located in Prague because, you know, you have a really great

03:22>> talent here that, you know, can take €23,000 a month and they are, you know, happy as, you know, I don't know what. And, you know, for 2 to $3,000, I mean, a month, can sell them to, you know, three clients.

Nathan Latka

03:39Okay. So you have three or four designers you're working with consistently right now? Yes. Okay. Interesting. Got it. And so, I guess, walk me through I mean, are you guys profitable today? Can you does the business model work? Is it sustainable?

Profitability and June 2023 Profit

Kerim Al-Lami

03:53>> Yeah. It's it's totally profitable, actually. So yeah.

Nathan Latka

03:57How how much profits in June this year?

Kerim Al-Lami

04:00>> Yeah. We've done about counting, like, €15,000.

Nathan Latka

04:06Yeah. Okay. And that's pretty good. I mean, look, I'm doing

Kerim Al-Lami

04:08>> the math.

Nathan Latka

04:09Four customers, $5 a month. You're doing 20,000 a month top line. After you pay designers, you pay your salaries, you pay your software expenses, you're profiting $1,015,000 a month.

Kerim Al-Lami

04:19>> Yes. Yes. Like, we don't really pay ourselves salaries, you know, and stuff like that, but, you know, that's

Nathan Latka

04:24So you guys split the profits of 15 k between the both of you?

Plans for Internal Software Product

Kerim Al-Lami

04:28>> Yeah. Like, we reinvest them to the company and, you know, hiring and stuff like that. So yeah.

Nathan Latka

04:33That's awesome. Are you guys thinking about launching your own internal software product?

Kerim Al-Lami

04:38>> Yeah. We were really thinking about it, but I think and I believe that our clients really value the simplicity because right now we work on Trello. But, you know, in the future, it's I don't think it's quite sustainable with twenty, thirty, you know, 40 clients. So this is something that we are really kind of like thinking about and even, planning. So yeah.

Nathan Latka

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07:24the interview. That makes sense. How did you get the first four customers? Talk me about the sales process.

How the First Four Customers Were Acquired

Kerim Al-Lami

07:30>> Yeah. Absolutely. Basically, they were all inbound clients or leads as we didn't do any called outreach or anything like that. They usually are our past clients we have worked with before or know new clients that, you know, just saw what we are doing. And we haven't, like, really, you know, doing any any marketing, sales, outreach, or anything like that so far since we are in such early stage. But, yeah,

08:00>> that all of them are inbound

Nathan Latka

08:02and Mhmm. Yeah. Well, I mean, how people say all of them are inbound, but inbound doesn't just happen. Right? If you launch a site in the middle of a forest and make no noise, no one's gonna find it. So you must have done something to get people to find you.

LinkedIn Post and Email Outreach

Kerim Al-Lami

08:15>> Oh, no. Absolutely. Yeah. We just, you know, put out one LinkedIn post that, you know, we are launching this new business.

08:23>> Me and my co founder have worked with hundreds of clients before. You know, we have all them, all of them in our connections. We emailed some of them.

08:34>> And, yeah, basically, you know, some of them converted, some of them, you know, are still hesitating and we have calls and stuff like that. But, yeah, I think it's about, you know, proving that that you know what you're doing and having a great portfolio and, you know, doing all that.

Nathan Latka

08:51What kinds of work are you are they paying you $5 a month for? Is it mainly sort of website design or what are you paying for?

Scope of Work and Design Services

Kerim Al-Lami

08:58>> So basically, pride ourselves on having these full stack designers, which means that it's someone who knows how to do brand, website, and product. So whether you need, you know, like a new brand, a new website, new product, or anything in between, we can, you know, provide that. Right now, the most work we have is for website, web design, and web flow. However, in the past, it was mostly product design, so UI, UX, and stuff like that.

Nathan Latka

09:29Interesting. And I love how you structured your pricing page. Take me through that. You have revolution design and you have senior designer, agency, and freelancer. How are

Kerim Al-Lami

09:36>> you winning So

Pricing Page and Competitive Positioning

Kerim Al-Lami

09:38>> basically, are three. I think the core fundamental problem with all all three of them is that, you know, they are paid by the hour. And, you know, like, many people don't realize that, you know, when designers are paid by the hour, they intentionally delay projects. I'm kind of guilty of guilty of that too. Of my friends are as well because, you know, when you are fast, well, basically a tech startup needs someone who can deliver fast,

10:06>> incredible results, you get paid the least, you know, and when you are slow, you can pay more. So I think that's like the core fundamental problem with all of them. However, like these three solutions, the agency freelancer and the full time designer, they all So for example, hiring a full time designer usually takes up to forty one days and usually costs between 120, $160,000 a year in New York, San Francisco. That's basically where my clients are

10:39>> from. And you get the benefit of working with them on a day to day basis. They get to know your brand and stuff like that. You know, agency usually costs between 50 to $100,000 a project. And usually that's not very feasible at the start. And, you know, finding a great one is, you know, hard also, but not that not as hard as, you know, hiring or finding a really great freelancer because hiring a great freelancer, which

11:07>> is like they call the middle between agency and full time designer is like searching for a needle in a haystack because you never know which way we

Nathan Latka

11:18found our design agency is we started off on Dribbble and Behance, and we hired for one project. And then we realized the person that we were using is part of an agency. And then before you know it, we grew to the agency program. Are you guys using Dribbble and Behance for your top of funnel? Will you do one off projects on those sites to land a larger customer?

Kerim Al-Lami

11:36>> Actually, my cofounder, he has been designing for almost eleven years or ten years, and he had all of his projects from Dribbble. You know? I, you know, never got on Dribbble or Behance or anything like that.

Nathan Latka

11:49So have you gotten a customer from Dribbble or no?

Kerim Al-Lami

11:51>> No. No. No. Actually So it's

Nathan Latka

11:52not working for you?

Website Audit Tripwire Product

Kerim Al-Lami

11:55>> Actually, yeah. We had one. Actually, it was this, you know, web free web free wallet called Qualaboblet. I'll call it bio I'll call it those labs. They they saw my cofounder's, you know, portfolio.

Nathan Latka

12:08Dribble on the hands does work for you for top of one. I'm trying to pull lessons for the audience. If you're trying to

12:12>> do the

12:12same thing, get on Dribble on the hands. Second The thing you do on your website is you offer a website audit for $4.95 at your top of funnel, I imagine. It's a, you know, a tripwire product here. How many of these have you done?

Kerim Al-Lami

12:23>> Yeah. We've done about, like, two, three of them so far. Yeah. They convert one of them converted, so it was like 33%. But yeah. Not in a scaling are not scaling right now. So yeah.

Nathan Latka

12:37Can So what's your goal for the end of the year? How much revenue are you hoping for this year?

Revenue and Customer Goals for Year End

Kerim Al-Lami

12:40>> Oh, we definitely want to hit the 20 clients, a $100,000 a month. Would be probably in the first

Nathan Latka

12:47That's a lot of growth. That's like five x growth from where you're at today.

Kerim Al-Lami

12:51>> Yeah. I mean, we are in the not in not at the end of the even, like, the first year. And we haven't even done any outreach and stuff like that. So, yeah, quite exciting.

Nathan Latka

13:02Alright. We'll see what happen we'll see what happens, Kerim. In the meantime here, let's wrap up with the famous five. Number one, your favorite book?

Kerim Al-Lami

13:08>> Yeah. That has to be The Great CEO Whipped in by Matt McCurry.

Nathan Latka

13:12Number two, is there a CEO you're following or studying?

Kerim Al-Lami

13:15>> Elon Musk probably.

Nathan Latka

13:17Yeah. Number four number three, what's your favorite online tool for building revolution design?

13:24Figma and Webflow. Yeah. Number four, how many hours of sleep do get every night?

Kerim Al-Lami

13:28>> Oh, like, six, five.

Nathan Latka

13:30And what's your what's your situation? Married, single kid?

Kerim Al-Lami

13:33>> Yeah. I have a girlfriend, long term girlfriend.

Nathan Latka

13:35Yeah. So no kids?

Kerim Al-Lami

13:36>> Yeah. Fortunately.

Nathan Latka

13:38And how old are you, Kerim?

Kerim Al-Lami

13:41>> I'm 22.

Famous Five Rapid Fire Questions

Nathan Latka

13:4222. Last question.

Kerim Al-Lami

13:43>> Something you wish you knew two years ago when you were 20.

13:48>> I mean, you know, be more ambitious probably. Take on more risks, I would say.

Nathan Latka

13:55Guys, there you have it. Revolution. Design is trying to help you get design done faster and more affordably in a more reliable way. They've got four customers today paying $5 a month. Launched just eight months ago, already doing 20,000 a month in revenue. Again, this is sort of that blend between a design agency plus recurring SaaS fee, hoping to keep these customers sticky. We usually see a lot of churn. They haven't lost any customers so far.

14:16Only four. They haven't lost any of them, which is good. We'll see what happens next. Kerim, thanks for taking us to the top. Yeah. Thanks. One more thing before you go. We have a brand new show every Thursday at 1PM central. It's called Shark Tank for SaaS. We call it deal or bust. One founder comes on, three hungry buyers, they try and do a deal live and the founder shares back end dashboards, their expenses, their revenue,

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