EstateSpace Revenue, Valuation & Funding (2025)

[00:00] Family offices pay estatespace to manage hundreds of properties. He charges per seat. His biggest customer pays $7,000 a month. He's up to $20,000 a month in total revenue or $250,000 run rate. Just closed a 3,200,000 seed round at a 17,000,000 pre money valuation, But it's really because of the traction he had before that with his agency doing millions and millions a year in revenue, doing custom solutions for the same customers he's now serving today. That's why [00:22] he's now scaling so quickly, and that's what allowed him to get the seed round done in a market that's crazy where no one can get deals done. Team of 17 as he looks to scale, new version coming out here shortly. Hey, folks. My guest today is Jonathan Fischbeck. He is building estatespace.com. It's estate management simplified. Jonathan, you ready to take us to the top? [00:40] >> Always. Thank you, Nathan, for having me. [00:42] No one thinks about estate planning. How do you make them think about this so they pay you? [00:46] >> Yeah. So I think from an estate planning perspective, where estatespace really is is is setting the bar is when we're dealing with real property assets. So we're talking about managing your property, maintaining your property, managing your assets and maintaining those assets, ultimately coming back to where we started as fintech, right? We want to help appreciate the value of the things that you own and help you manage them better. We want to add depth to your general [01:12] >> ledger and your balance sheet where it might just be a single line item. And then from there, we also want to help you slow down the depreciation of assets that might lose value over time and helping you extend the life of things that you own. So ultimately, you know, the way that we when we started the company, we saw, you know, I've got marketable securities. I have real estate and alternative investments, but who's really managing all [01:36] >> my stuff? And and that's how we that's how we really started. That was a genesis in the idea for estatespace. Mhmm. [01:42] How you know, for me, when I think about managing my own sort of stuff, like, want somebody, a person that I can call focused on it. How do you get people to sort of trust this using soft like, to invest in software to run this process versus someone, a wealth manager, for example? [01:58] >> Right. So it's an emerging space, right? In the last ten years, family offices specifically have started getting into the fulfillment of the lifestyle of the individual that they're serving, whether it's a single or multifamily. And so we saw an opportunity to really help them with the things that they struggled on, like finding the right person to do the thing that they're looking for, the request being that they need to fulfill. So we've actually had a lot [02:23] >> of excitement around helping these families and family offices scale automatically through estatespace. [02:29] So are they paying you directly versus versus individual consumers paying you directly to manage estates? [02:35] >> Yeah. So we're b to c to b. So we yeah. Exactly. So so it may [02:39] be B b to c. [02:41] >> Yes. Exactly. [02:42] Yeah. Interesting. So how many family offices pay you something today? [02:47] >> Right now, we've got about 65 family offices on the platform in the last when we launched what was it? April thirtieth of this year. [02:54] And and wait. Why do I have that your launch date was 2017? [02:58] >> Well, that's when we started the company, but we launched our commercial prod product. We we so we did an alpha to a beta. We went through that process with with our clients in in order to get to a commercial ready product for both web and mobile, this last April. [03:13] You had, though, revenue before this year. Right? [03:17] >> Absolutely. Yeah. So we we were, you know, as part of my, under 500 story, right? We were doing services, so we were doing a lot of things. It was hard for me to break that service mindset, and we were able to really pivot to complete SaaS here in the last eighteen months. So we've now kind of sunset our services and now we're we're changing all of our revenue over from what was non subscriptions to all subscription [03:42] >> based. [03:43] I see. So, when we spoke in 2021, you said you had about 50 customers and they were paying, I guess, services here as well, but you did about 2,200,000 in total revenue that year. Is that accurate? [03:53] >> That is accurate. Yes. [03:55] I see. And but no 0% of that was SaaS? [03:58] >> Yeah. It was it was it was yeah. It was like, no. Not 0%, but maybe 5% of that revenue was SaaS revenue. And so now flipping the script. So we pivoted to pure SaaS. We do no services at this point in time. [04:13] Oh, what's going on there, YouTube? Good to see you guys. Now imagine this. You love watching these interviews with SaaS founders, but imagine if we took all of the valuation data out from over 2,807 interviews I've done manually. Saves you a lot of time. Well, we've done this. We've built it into the beautiful interface inside of Founderpath. Check this out. I'll show you how you can access this in a second. But you log in, you connect [04:36] your Stripe account, you see your valuation real time. You can see what it changed over the past eighty eight days and even set goals for valuation this year. Now the secret evaluation is there's many different ways to value a SaaS business. So the reason you're gonna see three or four different valuations inside of your Founderpath dashboard, this is all free by the way, is because depending on who's doing the buying of your SaaS company, you're gonna [05:00] get a different valuation. A VC is gonna pay a different valuation, Private equity firm is different. If you're gonna do a minority sale, that's different. And if you sell the whole business, that's a different valuation. You can see all those when I hover over here. Right? So the teal is what a VC would pay. Yellow is what private equity And red is if you sold the whole thing outright. Now what's cool about this is this is [05:22] not built off random data. Again, you guys hear these interviews on YouTube. All these datas are built from real time valuation data points founder share with us on the show. So traction 1,200,000 seed round 3.7 raise. They sold 22% of their business. Go in here and filter by the event. Maybe you only wanna see companies that have sold the whole business. Well, here are a bunch that have been acquired the valuation and the multiple. Maybe you're [05:48] going out right now and you're raising your seed round. We'll go in here and look at all this recent seed deals that went down, what they raised, what valuation they raised at and what percent that they sold. There's never been a larger dataset of SaaS valuations than what you can get now inside of Founderpath. And we're thrilled to bring it to you. All right. We're gonna go back to the YouTube video here in a second. But [06:10] if you wanna check this tool out, if you wanna jump in and sign up, you can check it out for free to get your valuation at this link, this link, founderpath.com/products/valuations. Or if you go to founderpath.com and hover over products, click on get your valuation here, and go ahead and sign up to give it a whirl. Again, all that valuation data live right inside the platform. I hope to see you there. Alright. Let's jump back into [06:36] So will revenue decline this year because you shut off all that service revenue while you're scaling your SaaS? [06:42] >> Yeah. So we're we're actually doing a, a a seed round funding right now. So we're, we're we're raising capital. I put in more capital. We're still bootstrapped. So we're doing this through friends, family, partners, our closed network, and our board. And then we'll, we're we're scaling back up. So we're probably we just crossed 250,000 in in recurring revenue in ARR in this in the past five months since we launched our [07:09] So you're doing so you're doing 20,000 a month in MRR, which is a $250,000 run rate, and that that'll that's your revenue for this year? [07:15] >> No. Our revenue by the end of the year should probably some be somewhere around 600,000. So Okay. [07:20] So you still have 400 of services or something? 400? Yep. I see. I see. Okay. [07:26] >> Yep. So that's the exactly. We we've we've still got, like, annual legacy, just under a $500,000 in ARR coming from services. [07:34] How do you manage that storyline, especially if you're raising now? Even just with employees? I mean, imagine when you close books in 2021 and you do 2,200,000 revenue and then 2022, it's gonna go down, you know, significantly down to 600. But the story is, hey, guys, we're moving to higher margin SaaS. That's a hard storyline to manage. I mean, any employee looking at the books is going, oh my gosh, we just declined by a lot. How [07:52] do you manage that storyline? [07:53] >> Yeah. So I'm transparent and honest, right? So I've just told every employee kind of what we're doing, right? The same story I'm telling you right now. So I'm I'm we're raising we're raising around 3,250,000 that'll take us through the end of next year. We'll be about $2,000,000 in ARR by the end of next year, and it'll all be SaaS. And so actually, have more excitement from our staff than we did. And we've also it wasn't like [08:18] >> I had to sell that to all 17 people that work with us now, right? At that point in time, we were only about six people. So it was just me and a few other people at that time. So we tripled in size here in the last eighteen months now that we made that transition over to us. [08:33] Interesting. How much equity do you think you'll have to sell at your current size to raise 3,200,000? [08:39] >> So I've already raised 2.4. Okay. [08:42] And what does that mean? That's committed, signed, wired? [08:45] >> Yep. So it's, so closed closed and signed, closed off. We're at just under 2.1 and then we've got another 350 k of, commit of soft commit at this point. [08:56] Okay. And when's the first close? When are you gonna take the first wires you think? [08:59] >> Already started doing it. So I've already got $2,000,000 in the bank. [09:02] So then I don't have we don't have to speculate. Right? So so what valuation did you set or cap if it's a note? [09:08] >> Yeah. So we did we did we're just we're doing pure equity sell common stocks and we set $17,000,000 pre money. [09:15] Mhmm. Yep. [09:17] >> And that's gonna be somewhere around $2,121.07 post by the time this is all said and done. And then we'll, we're positioning the company right now, to put, you know, we we feel that based on the the market comps, the business model of cash that we've already raised, we support that and that we're we're gonna be adding significant value over the course of the next twelve to eighteen months here as we potentially look to to either do [09:42] >> another round or, you know, as we talked last week, potentially doing something here with Founderpath. [09:48] Yeah. How how do you get, I mean, look. At your stage, the revenue is almost meaningless. It's really about do they believe in you and your story. Right? Which clearly they do because you're raising this amount of money in a time when, like, no one can raise. Right? Now if you did do a revenue multiple, right, 17,000,000, right, on a $250,000 company, it's a 68 x multiple, which isn't I mean, you know, again, I wouldn't say [10:10] that that's important. What's important is a story you're telling. So but point being, there's lot people listening that are at your stage that are trying to raise this kind of round. How did you get it done? [10:19] >> You know, I think it was it was kind of what you just said. Right? I mean, people aren't investing in my multiple right now. They're investing in the company. They're investing in the vision. They're investing in Jonathan and and where we are. Right? We have traction. So we were able to leverage our traction. We were able to leverage the space that we're in and we've kind of created a marketplace. So I would say some of my [10:42] >> advice is, again, we've been successful by staying two inches wide and two miles deep. So we're not saying that we're property management simplified. We have a very specific goal with the company. And so with that story and that transparency, it resonates with our investors and shareholders. It also resonates with our buyers, right? Like they get that we are purpose built. So when it comes to some of when we start to look inside the numbers, I've been [11:10] >> able to raise capital because we have over a 90% retention rate for paying clients, right? We have some issues prior to that on activation that we are that there are things that we can solve for but from a you know, from a from a raise perspective, you know, we started this raise on September 6 and it's been, you know, and then the market kind of turns down and, you know, we were just we just stayed honest [11:35] >> and we just, you know, stuck to what it is that we do and what we know. And ultimately, you know, we've we've had success raising capital, Nathan. [11:42] Yeah. No. It's good. I mean, it is interesting to compare, though. I mean, I I believe I remember when we talked in 2021, you said you turned down a $20,000,000 acquisition offer. Right? Yep. So so you're now raising at a at a valuation that's equal to or slightly below that. Right? How do you think about that? [11:59] >> I don't. You know, I mean, I think that I look Should [12:02] you have sold for 20,000,000? [12:05] >> No. No. I mean, I I I I see this company being much more valuable than $20,000,000, and I was not in a position [12:12] But then why are you raising right now at a 17,000,000 valuation? If you think it's gonna be if it it's gonna be worth way more. [12:18] >> Just because that was what I was able to get. Right? So, I mean, working with some of our primary investors and myself, I mean, we felt like that was the that was an appropriate number that we were able to get kind of that first initial one and a half through a primary investor of ours. So that was, you know, that was just where we ended up with this deal. [12:34] Fair fair enough. Fair enough. Okay. Very cool. So 65, customers doing 20,000 a month in revenue. So they're each paying about $300 per month on average. Do you have any of the 65 customers that are paying, you know, a grand per month or $2,000 per month? Like, why what are the big customers? What are they paying you for? [12:50] >> Yeah. So our largest client is about 7,000 of that a month. Oh, wow. We have yep. And so with with where we are right now, we have a release coming out end of this month. So it's our 3.5. 3.0 is our April release. So now we're on our fifth release since our primary. And with that, we're reaching a maturity level on our platform of a three out of five. And with that, what that means for us [13:16] >> is that why if people come and we have like a 52% closed win, why isn't it higher? Because we're missing feature functionality. We got something out there, right? So I think the story in SaaS, it's always just put some put yourself out there, right? Get a product out there, get feedback. [13:30] But what's the seven k customer paying for? I I wanna know that. Are they paying for more seats? Is there a specific feature they you upgraded them against? What are they why are they paying so much more? [13:39] >> Property maintenance and project management feature sets. We've opened yep. And they're they're a large b two b. So they're they see estatespace. It's gonna be fuel [13:49] Large, no measure by what? Is is it number of employees at their company, number of properties they manage directly? What's the utility numb the number? [13:57] >> Yep. So they they have about, just under 200 employees. They're doing between 50 and $100,000,000 in revenues annually, and they're managing over a 100 properties. [14:07] So that's why they'll pay you 7 k because you charge per property. Right? Or and or something like that? [14:12] >> We charge per we're just per per user per month. [14:15] So it's against the 200 employees? Yep. I see. I see. Okay. Interesting. Very interesting. [14:21] >> Estatespace isn't designed just for your company or the people that are in it. [14:27] >> Like when we talk about an inclusive mindset, right? We have created a platform with very specific and very flexible roles and permissions to allow for our clients to involve their entire ecosystem. So we might have a family that has 15 properties, and each one of those properties has vendors that are helping them maintain it on a daily, weekly, monthly basis. Those individuals could be a vendor, could be a member of their estatespace, and they're actually communicating [14:57] >> and tasking and doing all of those transactions with that vendor through estatespace. So they're paying for that vendor to be someone that they're able to then securely manage and protect their interests. [15:09] Understood. Love the story, Jonathan. We're out of time, though. Let's wrap up here with the famous five. Number one, favorite book. [15:15] >> It would be, The E-Myth Revisited. [15:18] You're consistent. That was your favorite two years ago as well. Number oh, no. [15:21] >> The revisited version. [15:22] There you go. It's the update. [15:23] >> Yeah. Revisited and Traction. Those were the two that kinda got me kicked off into becoming a serial entrepreneur here. [15:28] Number two, is there a CEO you're following or studying? [15:31] >> Yeah. I mean, it's still gonna be, Bezos. It's still gonna be, Apple. It's those are gonna be my top two that I follow. [15:37] Number number three, what's your favorite online tool for building, the business? [15:42] >> I mean, I'd say that, you know, from a peer development perspective, we're using Atlassian. I do love it. It works. Leave it at that. [15:50] Fair. Number four, how many hours of sleep to get every night? [15:53] >> Seven. [15:54] Okay. And what's your situation? Married, single, kids? [15:57] >> Happily married, three kids, two dogs, four birds, and a partridge in a pear tree. [16:02] That's amazing. What? You're 40 now? 41? [16:05] >> I just turned 40. Yeah. [16:06] Just turned 40. Yeah. Very cool. Last question. Something you wish you knew when you were 20. [16:12] >> To get good advice before starting a company. Find somebody that's already done it. Right? That's what I I always wish I I would have known that it took me about eighteen years in business to actually learn that one. So that's my always my number one advice. [16:28] Guys, family offices pay estatespace to manage hundreds of properties. He charges per seat. His biggest customer pays $7,000 a month. He's up to $20,000 a month in total revenue or $250,000 run rate. Just closed a 3,200,000 seed round at a 17,000,000 pre money valuation. But it's really because of the traction he had before that with his agency, doing millions and millions a year in revenue, doing custom solutions for the same customers he's now serving today. That's [16:50] why he's now scaling so quickly, and that's what allowed him to get the seed round done in a market that's crazy where no one can get deals done. Team of seventeen, as he looks to scale, new version coming out here shortly. Jonathan, thanks for taking us to the top. [17:00] >> Thanks, Nathan. Appreciate it. See you soon. [17:03] One more thing before you go. We have a brand new show every Thursday at 1PM central. It's called Shark Tank for SaaS. We call it deal or bust. One founder comes on, three hungry buyers, they try and do a deal live and the founder shares back end dashboards, their expenses, their revenue, ARPU, CAC, LTV, you name it, they share it and the buyers try and make a deal live. It is fun to watch every Thursday, 1PM [17:28] Central. Additionally, remember these recorded founder interviews go live. We release them here on YouTube every day at 2PM Central. To make sure you don't miss any of that, make sure you click the subscribe button below here on YouTube, the big red button, and then click the little bell notification to make sure you get notifications when we do go live. I wouldn't want you to miss breaking news in the SaaS world, whether it's an acquisition, a big [17:51] fundraise, a big sale, a big profitability statement or something else. I don't want you to miss it. Additionally, if you want to take this conversation deeper and further, we have by far the largest private Slack community for B2B SaaS founders. You want to get in there. We've probably talked about your tool if you're running a company or your firm if you're investing. You can go in there and quickly search and see what people are saying. Sign [18:12] up for that at nathanlatka.com/slack. In the meantime, I'm hanging out with you here on YouTube. I'll be in the comments for the next thirty minutes. Feel free to let me know what you thought about this episode and if you enjoyed it, click the thumbs up. We get a lot of haters that are mad at how aggressive I am on these shows, but I do it so that we can all learn. We have to counter those people. [18:32] We got to push them away. Click the thumbs up below to counter them and know that I appreciate your guys'support. Alright, I'll be in the comments. See you.

[00:00] Hey, guys, my guest today is Jonathan Fishbeck. He's the Founder and CEO of EstateSpace, a technology platform that simplifies lifestyle management service and operations to maintain real property assets to help reduce risk and protection and protect wealth succession. He was previously the Founder and CEO at a design build firm whose focus was advising, designing, constructing and operationalizing sizable estate properties for families and family offices. Jonathan, you ready to take us to the top? [00:25] >> Absolutely. Thanks. Thanks, Nathan. [00:27] Who's thinking about this? Like an 80 year old with 10,000,000 in real estate assets and three nephews and they don't know how to divide it amongst the nephews? [00:34] >> No. So our clients are going be typically between the age of like 35 and 55. So we spent a lot of our time working with CEOs, technology founders, entrepreneurs that ended up accumulating a lot of assets very quickly and the level of complexity started to grow very rapidly. [00:56] Interesting. Okay, so tell me how you help them. What's big mistake that a bunch of my listeners right now, maybe they made a million bucks real quick. What's a mistake they might make with that million that you can help them with? [01:06] >> Yeah, so I think where we're helping people out is on all of the things that are non financial. So they buy homes, they buy cars, they start to accumulate a lot of things, right? The more money that you make, the more things that you have the ability to buy. And a lot of times people start to accumulate very rapidly. What ends up happening is that they're reacting to managing those things, right? So we help people proactively [01:27] >> manage those things where they're saving time, they're saving money. They actually know what they have and where it is at all times. I know what bank accounts I have. I know where all my financial stuff is. I've got a team of people managing it. A lot of times with all of my physical assets, and that's where we really step in to help, you know, you're managing your home in a reactive way. I have a water leak, [01:47] >> so now I fix it, whereas we're helping you productively prevent that water leak and ultimately helping you kind of enjoy things you should be able to come home and enjoy, not things that you should be worrying about. [01:59] Okay, interesting. What am I going to pay you on average per month to use this technology? [02:04] >> So if you're a single person, you're paying $45 a month. If you have a team of 200, then your per user cost is going to go down based on the number of people that you have. So whether you're a small business, I'm a three time founder, so I've always wanted a platform that I could buy that might cost me a couple $100 for a five, six person team to be able to manage my business, manage my [02:25] >> clients, and ultimately not have to do a bunch of rework because I have a system that's intelligent enough to allow me to do all those things, capture that information in a database driven experience to ultimately give people what they need, when they want based on their role, based on their permissions. [02:42] Now, when did you launch this and where did get the idea? Do you have it before you were doing work at the family office or did you see problems at the family office that gave you the idea? [02:50] >> Yeah, so this actually came from my previous venture as working with ultra high net worth families as a general contractor, and we finished a very large project. It took us about six years. There was tens of thousands of pages of documents, and I knew no one would ever look at them, read them. It was very difficult to consume. And so the idea for EstateSpace came about five years ago when we found it impossible to transition a multi $10,000,000 project [03:16] >> to the client because there was just so much information. And so what ended up happening is we realized that we were now sucked into the facilities management role when that's not really what our company did. But obviously we adapted, we took care of the client. And so that was kind of the genesis. And then the maturation has really been moving from like the physical asset portfolio to property management, really now to communications and an end to [03:41] >> end operational platform that will allow workflows, business intelligence, and again, giving all members of your estate space the right information at any given time so that we're cutting down on a lot of the administrative inefficiencies that go on, especially in private residences. [03:59] Okay, so 2016 was when you launched the company? [04:02] >> 2017. [04:03] 2017. Okay, and now how many customers are you serving today? [04:06] >> Yeah, so we have over 50 families. We have multiple billionaires on the platform. We just started scaling a couple of months ago, so it's been a really exciting year. So we've exceeded our sales numbers from last year and the first month of this year, and we're really taking off. We've over the last So from the year of the idea, we had our first release in 'nineteen. Our 2.0 release was in 2020. And then 3.0 is coming [04:31] >> out middle of October of twenty twenty one. And that's what we're really excited for because we'll have end to end capabilities. Again, we've got workflows. We have a marketplace for service providers to help our clients on things that we don't do, as well as business intelligence. So those are kind of the three things when you think about EstateSpace. Now we'll have web, both mobile, Android, Apple, so we'll be able to be anywhere that our clients need [04:55] >> us to be. [04:56] Let's talk more about that in a second. But first, taking back to that beautiful sort of year '1, 2019 to get that release out, do you remember revenue that year, total revenue? [05:03] >> Yeah, that total revenue that year was probably about $150,000 [05:08] What was going through your head at the year end closeout? Were you exciting or were you bummed or what? [05:13] >> No, I think we were psyched, right? So that was kind of like our proof of concept launch. So we kind of saw that as like our beta launch. We got 13 clients and they were spread across ultra high net worth families, family offices, and then supporting service providers. So property management company, we also had an estate management company. And so we got all of the flavors that we were looking for, and then we were able to get [05:37] >> a ton of feedback. And then we were And that led to our 2.0 release, which was So we were launched September '19. Second one came in June 2020. And now this October is 3.0. That's probably what I'm most excited about. Again, we try to listen really well and then apply that feedback in a way that benefits all of our customers. [05:56] So $150,000 in 2019, what did you scale up to in 2020? [06:00] >> So we did a million in 2020 and we did 1.4 in January of this year and we continue to scale that number up this year. [06:07] Is that 1.4 cash collected like you pulled a bunch of annual payments in that first month? [06:12] >> No, so that was just contracts won and then that was aggregated over a 12-month period. [06:18] I see. So I guess the way to ask would be like last month, what was your monthly recurring revenue? Would you say? [06:24] >> About 175,000. [06:27] Wow. Okay. Got it. So got it. So you're you're I guess you just broke essentially $2,000,000 run rate. You know, what do think you'll finish the year at? [06:34] >> So I'm hoping to throw about another 750 to 1.1 on top of it. That's what I project. [06:39] Where is the growth coming from? Is it more seats across the same 50 customers or adding brand new families altogether? [06:45] >> Yeah. No. It's it's adding it's now that we're now that we have our our web application, coming out, we're able to start onboarding businesses. So we're able to So a lot of our families are going be anywhere from about five to 10 users, Nathan, but businesses can be anywhere from 50 to a couple thousand because EstateSpace is built for everyone in your ecosystem. So you think about a business, right? You might have employees, you have vendors, [07:11] >> you have suppliers, you have clients. All of those people are members of your EstateSpace. [07:17] So Yeah, Nathan, sorry, I wanna make sure my audience doesn't miss this. You're really playing in like the physical asset management space. For example, if you are a CEO and you buy 30 Macs for 30 team members, I could manage those max on your platform. Is that accurate? [07:32] >> It is. [07:33] Yeah. So it's not just like you own a mansion and you need to do like tax planning. It's like you're really again, this is an asset class is growing very quick. There are a lot of SaaS companies in this space growing quickly. You're in this space. Yes. Interesting. Okay. How are you finding customers? [07:48] >> So it's kind of threefold. So we're campaigning for very specific people. So we're finding people through LinkedIn. We have an extensive network. Part of the beauty about EstateSpace is myself, my partner, we were able to roll up about eighteen years of human capital into this company. Our whole network was really applicable. And then we have a team that's out doing outreach. We have a digital inbound funnel as well. So we're advertising, we're marketing, but we're targeting [08:20] >> the people that we feel that we can really have the biggest impact on. And so that's the high net worth individuals, executive family offices, and then the supporting service providers. And when I say that, we're focusing on more of a luxury market as our go to market. So like a luxury contract management company or a consultant that's helping with something to do with more on the estate management or property management side. Those are kind of the [08:50] >> main targets that we're going after from a B2B perspective. [08:54] Last month, how much did you spend [08:55] on just paid ads? [08:57] >> Probably about $3. [09:00] And how many? That's not a ton. Yeah. How many new customers did you have last month? [09:04] >> One. [09:05] Okay. Okay. [09:08] So is that sort of the right CAC? You're willing to spend about $3 to get a new customer? [09:12] >> No. So right now, because we're sunsetting 2.0 and releasing 3.0, we're starting to pivot our marketing and our messaging. Our website will be turning over next month. So we have, I'd say, a handful of referrals that are coming on for the 2.0 release, which was mobile centric, mobile first, with a very simple web supporting application. And so not to confuse our upcoming buyers and a lot of the people that are in our pipeline, we're going to [09:42] >> be pivoting all of that. So I'm kind of okay with that. But typically, on average, 3,000 to $5,000 is going to get us 3,000,000 to 5,000,000 eyeballs. And then from there, we're looking at about 500 leads that probably end up somewhere around 150 of sales qualified leads that typically from there, we start working down about anywhere from 20% to 50% by the time that you get down to it. That 5,000 should really lead to about 10 [10:11] >> customers in a month. [10:12] I see. Now, have you bootstrapped all this or do you guys raise? [10:15] >> Family owned and operated, built in The United States. [10:18] I love that. So do you own 100%? [10:20] >> So myself, then my family, and then I'd say there's we have eight stakeholders, but myself and my family, we own 88% of the company in year five. [10:31] That's very cool. Any plans to raise or do you want to stay bootstrapped? [10:35] >> So we were going to have plans to raise, but we ended up really getting the right clients and the right people in the company. And then we're scaling now. So there's no I've taken that off the table, given how exhausting it was to raise some of money just internally right now. So no plans of like a formal series A at this point. What do [10:55] you mean by that raising money internally? [10:57] >> Just mean working with myself and my direct family to figure out what capital we wanted to allocate to this venture. Right. So that ended up, know, it's just all very time consuming. Was looking to raise with family and friends. I'd say I think we raised somewhere around a million dollars. And then we've also had, you know, great, we had a client that came on that's also [11:21] What year was that? Sorry, when you raised a million? [11:24] >> Well, that was 2019. [11:26] Okay, so you did sort of raise, but it was all family and friends. [11:29] >> Yeah, well, it was like three family and friends. And then to date, we've invested just over $7,000,000 across the company, and that's about a million of that was not my direct family. [11:42] I see. I see. What would you value the company at today? [11:46] >> So we keep it really simple. So we're just 10x ARR. So by the end of this year, my goal is to get us somewhere to that 20,000,000 mark. And that's just a kind of a middle of the line conservative SaaS model because we are pure SaaS. [12:00] Yep. I mean, I personally would argue you're worth more than if you're already at $100,000 per month in revenue. Right. So it's about a $2,200,000 run rate. I'd say like minimum 60. Although you all you investors listening are going to like that I'm building Jonathan up like this, but I would say at least $6,670,000,000. [12:15] >> Yeah. I mean, like you, right? [12:18] You can pay me the commission after their call. [12:21] >> All right. [12:21] No, just kidding, Jonathan. What's the team size today? How many folks? [12:24] >> So we just scaled the company. So we were at six about six months ago, and now we're at 13 going to 15. That's mainly consists first, we tripled our development team. And then from there, [12:36] we How many developers? [12:38] >> We have eight total developers. And now we're starting to add salespeople. And then from there, we'll backfill customer success. And that'll be a great problem to have. [12:48] How many quota carrying sales reps do you have? [12:51] >> Three. [12:52] And what's the quota? [12:53] >> So they're just coming on right now. They just are actually that team's growing Monday of next week. But their quotas to come out of the gate is going to be to get acclimated. And then as 3.0 hits, we'll expect to see anywhere from five to 10 sales per person per month. [13:12] Got it. What does that mean in terms of new ARR in the first twelve months you want them to drive? [13:15] >> So, I mean, if you're just going kind of on average deal flow size, I mean, one of them should be bringing in anywhere from 10 to 25,000 at best, I would say to start. [13:25] Yep. So call it like a $300,000 first year quota on the high side, dollars 25,000 a month, right? And new MRR. Yep. Yeah. Interesting. That's always the hardest part is when you're making those first three hires, like what quota do you give them, but also give them time to ramp up. They don't want to overwhelm them on day one and then they get demotivated. [13:44] >> Yeah. So it's kind of one of those things where we're just super transparent, Nathan, right? So we just tell them kind of where they are. They know they're coming in on the ground level, gave them the opportunity to sell what we have now, but it's kind of maybe counterproductive to their long term goals. So they're coming all in on three point zero's release, and that's really great, right? Because ultimately they're going to know the company, they're [14:07] >> going to know the client, they're going to know the product, and they're going to be able to make sure that everyone's a great fit. Now, one of the great things about where we're going with three point zero, everything's user driven. We've integrated Stripe right into the platform. We're in the process of getting SOC compliance and really taking our company to the next level. And all of that for our clients means easy buying. So you're able to [14:30] >> just click to sign up, page, click to sign in and go. And then from there, it's software as a service. And we're supporting all your technology needs, but we've built an affiliate partner program to help someone that has any size house do all of the digital cataloging. We have partners to help you with advice. Being in the space as a consultant and an owner rep for about a decade now, the hardest thing for most of our [14:55] >> families, most of our clients, is getting good advice at the right time and finding really great people to help them. And so we try to not only unblock the road from an intuitive technology platform perspective, but also surround them with a marketplace of service providers that can help them accelerate and maximize the things that estate space can do for their family. Now, [15:15] you mentioned obviously you're bootstrapping this, right? You put 7,000,000 in yourself and then 1,000,000 from sort of outsiders. But are you guys profitable today or burning capital? [15:23] >> We're still burning a little bit. Our profitability is we're probably about Well, not probably. We're $350k of annual recurring away from breakeven. [15:35] Of annual recurring. [15:36] >> Of annual recurring. [15:37] Yeah. So like that basically means $125,000 a month last year in revenue, spend like maybe a total of $220 or something on all expenses. [15:45] >> Yeah. So our expenses are less than what we're bringing in, but it's but from a from where we're going to grow this year, I want I need another $350k of annual recurring to support the scale and the growth that I have coming on. [15:58] I see. So, but if we just look last month, right? So what's last month? [16:02] >> Last month, we made more than we spent by about $15,000 Okay, [16:08] that's great. So profitable last month. But again, you're about to keep reinvesting in growth. So you'll need to keep adding up. [16:13] >> So I'd say it's not a perfect model when it comes to profitability. We just need to continue to keep building, keep growing, keep selling. [16:21] Yeah, I like that. All right. That should be the model for every SaaS founder, Jonathan. Let's wrap up here with the famous five. Number one, what's your favorite book? [16:28] >> I'd say my favorite book of all time is going to have to be The E Myth Revisited. [16:35] Number two, is there a CEO you're following or studying? [16:38] >> Absolutely. So, I mean, I follow like Bezos. I Amazon. I like to follow Apple. I like to follow Netflix. I'm a huge fan of those three for a number of different reasons. But yeah, I'd say those are probably the top three that I follow. [16:56] Number three, what's your favorite online tool for building a estate space? [16:59] >> I would say my favorite online tool for building a estate space. [17:04] Besides your own. [17:06] >> Okay. Yeah, I would probably have to say I would put InVision up there from a design to development perspective. It does a lot. So I'd say InVision. [17:14] Number four here. How many hours of sleep do you get every night? [17:18] >> Seven. Seven? That's pretty good. And what's your situation? [17:20] Married, single kids? [17:21] >> I'm happily married to my wife, Vanessa. I have three kids, a daughter of 15, a son who's four and another son who's two. I've got two beautiful dogs and five birds. [17:33] That's amazing. [17:34] >> How old are you, Jonathan? Jonathan, I [17:37] >> just turned 39, June 3. [17:39] Wow, okay, last question here. What's something you wish you knew when you were 20? [17:43] >> I wish I would have told myself to get good advice before I started a company. And not just good advice, right? I got that. I think it was getting good advice from somebody that was in the space that I was going into. So I was actually just asked a question of like, if I had $1,000 what would I spend it on? I've watched that same question get asked. But my answer was simple. I would pay for [18:07] >> really, really good advice because it's intrinsic, right? It's going to carry on value with me forever. So that's what I wish I knew. And that's kind of what I as I mentor and help other young CEOs and entrepreneurs, it's get good advice from somebody that's been in the space that you want to go into that's already done it because the mistakes early are the ones that cost the most. [18:30] Guys, at estatespace.com, if you're buying 50 Macs for your team, they'll help you track all those Macs real time, call it in physical asset management, right? $150,000 a year in revenue back in 2019 grew to a million last year. And this year, they're already at a $2,200,000 run rate. They've done all this bootstrapped using their own internal capital. They have over 50 customers that have average $3,500 per year for the platform. They were profitable last month, [18:52] $15,000 as they look to continue to scale with their team of 13 today, eight engineers, and their first three sales reps coming on board with $300,000 quota. We'll see what happens next. Jonathan, thanks for taking us to the top. [19:03] >> Awesome. Nathan, appreciate your time. [19:06] One more thing before you go. We have a brand new show every Thursday at 1PM Central. It's called Shark Tank for SaaS. We call it deal or bust. One founder comes on three hungry buyers. They try and do a deal live and the founder shares back end dashboards, their expenses, their revenue, ARPU CAC, LTV, you name it, they share it and the buyers try and make a deal live. It is fun to watch every Thursday one [19:31] p. M. Central. Additionally, remember these recorded Founder interviews go live. We release them here on YouTube every day at two p. M. Central. To make sure you don't miss any of that, make sure you click the subscribe button below here on YouTube, the big red button and then click the little bell notification to make sure you get notifications when we do go live. I wouldn't want you to miss breaking news in the SaaS world, whether it's [19:52] an acquisition, a big fundraise, a big sale, a big profitability statement or something else. I don't want you to miss it. Additionally, if you wanna take this conversation deeper and further, we have by far the largest private Slack community for B2B SaaS founders. You want to get in there. We've probably talked about your tool if you're running a company or your firm if you're investing. You can go in there and quickly search and see what people [20:14] are saying. Sign up for that at nathanlatka.com slack. In the meantime, I'm hanging out with you here on YouTube. I'll be in the comments for the next thirty minutes. Feel free to let me know what you thought about this episode and if you enjoyed it, click the thumbs up. We get a lot of haters that are mad at how aggressive I am on these shows, but I do it so that we can all learn. We have [20:34] to counter those people. We got to push them away. Click the thumbs up below to counter them and know that I appreciate your guys'support. Alright, I'll be in the comments. See you.