Adroll Revenue (2018)

hello everyone my guest today is toby grabner he's the ceo of admiral group and oversees both divisions of the company's growth platform business admiral and the recently launched roll works which we'll talk about today he's got leadership experience at high growth companies that span two decades including the forefront of positioning adderall as a key company in the marketing technology sector his experience includes serving as president of crot interactive one of the first large digital agencies and one of the first demand side platforms as president and ceo of adapt.tv under his leadership that company grew revenue from 200k to over 200 million in four years and was acquired by aol in 2013 for 465 million bucks all right toby you ready to take us to the top let's do it all right tell us about admiral and and focus first kind of on the core business what you really have been known for over the past long a period of time and then let's jump into roll works the new the new suite you've reached out absolutely so the genesis of the company was really focusing on providing what we would say are ambitious marketers marketers who are early in their uh journey in terms of having uh resources and and the tool sets to be able to compete effectively um so what what we bring to to market basically uh is is a powerful and easy to use platform for these resource-strapped or forward-thinking marketers and the the two big components of that are we have a proprietary data set that really enables us to be able to help our our clients better understand their customers and the prospects that they're going after that they're targeting and then be able to really execute on that in a myriad of different digital channels so whether that be um on desktop mobile in-app email and even on-site creating you know personalized promotional experiences for users as they hit our customers websites and and some figures have been released it sounds like in 2016 you guys passed the 300 million dollar run right now is that a pure play are you a pure play sas company or is there kind of a percentage of you know ads spent through your platform kind of model as well historically it's been the latter uh however um as we moved into 2018 and it's actually a good segue into the launch of roll works we're now what i would describe the hybrid so we have a you know traditional advertising type model that we bring to market but now we're also have moved into a sas world and uh we launched rollworks um really focused 100 on b2b marketers while uh we're solving a similar problem uh that we saw for our b2c customers um the you know tailoring of the the products um the the customer life cycle there's just a lot that's very different and as we started to take a step back and and see that that was a fast-growing part of our business it was very clear that we needed to create a unique standalone business unit that was going to focus on that particular audience and what we do for them is we actually on board their crm data again we enrich it with our huge proprietary data set and then execute on campaigns and demonstrate by pushing back into whether it's salesforce hubspot marketo how we're moving their prospects along the continuum of the different stages of a b2b life cycle sales process i want to dive deeper into that model but first let's just put a cap and a rubber band on the kind of percentage of ad spend model does that continue today to be about a 300 million dollar business for you guys or is that kind of still growing larger than that as well it's continuing to grow um uh it's it's still a great business we've been very fortunate in a market that's um had quite a bit of attrition of players you know we continue to be scaled and growing and it's something we're quite proud of we have a global footprint we operate in 120 uh different uh countries we've got 37 000 clients um on our platform 80 of them are self-serve so we've got this sort of big engine that continues to really drive and and yeah we're excited about our continued growth going forward and toby what was 2017 revenue just on that product line um on on our so the the the number you saw was actually our run rate going into uh i see as we go into 2018 we're building on top of that got it i mean 350 400 can you share that number uh we're seeing um we're not yet releasing we're seeing um good double-digit percentage growth okay fair enough good so i'll call it north of 10 growth that's healthy when numbers are getting that big so let's go full into roll works now okay so sas as you mentioned very different kind of business the way you just described role works the question i had in my head is there's a lot of these smbs small to middle size companies where they'll pay for licenses to things like clear bit or full contact to kind of enrich their data and time with their crms how is this rollworks product different it's different because of a a couple of areas one is um that it's very tied to uh the execution element of their campaigns so um you know each of those companies that you describe sort of provide a different way that they're enriching oftentimes really enabling sales folks to um you know get a better understanding of their name account list what we're doing is actually um looking at even things like intense signals um you know where uh are the the target accounts are in terms of their buying spectrum so we're able to really kind of dig in uh layers deeper that are driving ultimately as i mentioned before the prospects through the various stages of uh the sales cycle ultimately so it's a it's a slightly different use case on the data and again what we've got are 1.2 billion digital profiles um we have north of 300 million uh emails um and so we have a huge amount of uh intense signals that come in and we use that to really help drive uh the execution layer uh ultimately on the marketing side and what month and year was rollworks launched in so we uh launched our um abm our account based marketing solution in september of last year still under the the admiral uh banner so that was sort of our first um you know kind of foray in a movie more aggressively into b2b and then on february 27th of 2017 we officially launched the real world's brand okay got it and when was adderall launched as a company uh 2010. so we've been for a bit over 10 years now okay again just on the rollworks product you you just used a different term which is obviously your abm offering those are the same thing correct yeah abm uh is uh acronym for account based marketing yeah i just want to make sure that is account based marketing is what rollworks is delivering it is a a portion of that i think this is one of the um important differentiators is that we're really in market providing what we would call a you know really full solution b2b uh what we call growth platform but you can think of it as as almost like a cloud solution so it's not only the account based marketing we also do a fair amount in our heritages in driving in new leads um we have of course our flagship retargeting that that we bring to bear those actually are not necessarily uh what is considered true account based marketing but they're equally important in terms of driving opportunities into the funnel which then you're able to start to better understand uh and develop named account lists and then you go into more of an account based marketing uh type execution so when you look at the cohort that started using the rollworks product since you've launched it over the past year or so um what are they paying on average per month to use they use the tool so first of all we launched it with about 200 uh customers so um i think it's important you know going back to the heritage we we it was one of the fastest growing segments uh in the company um and uh we really saw an opportunity to lean in we brought over about 200 customers and the way the model works is that um our our customers uh kind of can sign up for two different pouches one is is that the traditional media solution if they're not ready to use abm yet so that includes retargeting prospecting again driving in sort of the unknown opportunities into their funnel uh ultimately the account based marketing and that by the way in the media uh spends on that can range um you know typically our minimums are around 10 grand but we have customers that are spending you know millions of dollars on an annualized basis and then the um the the sas space where we're doing the data enrichment uh component of it is our typically 12-month contracts um and they range you know depending on usage they can range as as as small as three grand and we have some that are in the seven eight thousand dollars on a monthly basis okay is it fair to say though if we look at an average across those initial 200 about three grand a year it is pretty standard on the sas side i would say our our typical contract sizes are probably between 35 and 45 000 on an annualized basis oh good okay good yeah yeah but but i do think it's important to uh call out is that we are early days on that and you know that's sort of like our our base level offering you know we are as you can imagine um we have a a very active product roadmap and we'll be introducing a lot more so um that will iterate over time but that's that's our baseline that we've gone out that's code for if you're if you're listening to us right now don't email toby and say wait your sales person just gave me a price that was four times what you said on nathan lacka's podcast why can't i get that deal and the answer is there's new products now i suspect they're not that hasn't happened yet but yeah very good now toby are you restricting the addition of new customers to this product right now is there still just 200 as you fine-tune or have you let others on no absolutely we're growing really quite rapidly we have a um as i alluded to before we stood up a full business unit um that that business unit makes a hundred people we obviously have a um a fairly robust sales operation so we're absolutely out aggressively bringing in new stuff so how many customers are on it today uh so we've been scaling um uh about 10 a month in terms of new customers okay you know if you the way i think about rollworks is really is a startup that has been spun out of uh admiral um you know with a sort of a strong foundation but you know our trajectory and you kind of went through my uh background you know i've been in early stage companies i i said to the team i was like you know most startups would kill to have the kind of growth that we're seeing uh this early um we've we've only been in market now for three four months um so it's been a pretty exciting start i mean and fair to say to if you've got 200 customers paying that average price point just for the sas product you just articulated i mean just that line is doing north of what 550 grand a month at this point correct uh no it's not it well you got to think about it on on total contract but it's not that we are um the way i would look at it nathan is is what we've already tipped over into over two million dollars in arr perfect i should have just asked that directly so you're already passed a two million dollar kind of run rate on that product yeah and for us that's really exciting i mean you know we've been on this journey of really transforming the company as i mentioned before of really moving uh to this uh combination of providing uh media solutions and um sas based again a lot of around data solutions to so to see that uh really taking off and you know it's grounded in our firm belief that marketing technology and ad technology tech and martech are really uh um starting to come together and we've really kind of been on the forefront of pushing those uh two solutions to start working in concert with one another and um so far it's been as on the rollworks i've been really validating to see that marketers are buying into that we're running out of time here toby but last few economics questions just on the rollworks product obviously your business is much bigger than just the row works but this is what you're most excited about what's churn right now on the product have you lost anybody no early days on that we're uh knock on wood i mean obviously um uh you know we don't want to get too far ahead of ourselves we will certainly have some turbulence along the way but so far um you know we're and part of it is also you know these are contracts so we won't really know until um you know this time next year i do want to call out while we are very excited about rollworks the admiral business and and sort of way we've been leaning in on that side going after you know we've rebranded and we're really focused on what we call ambitious or upstart uh you know direct to consumer brands but i'm sure you've been following on this explosion of companies you know we've really been at the nexus of that for a while and and um so that's an area that we're uh very excited about as well that's great now talk to me real quick of funding history i don't think you're bootstrapped how much have you raised uh we've raised 90 million to date last uh round we did is in 2014. are you raising right now we are not we're uh we we um dipped into profitability in 2017 that was a big milestone for us uh we're continuing to are you still profitable today yes and i'm just going to say 2018 we're continuing on that path um i i don't want to say that we wouldn't consider bringing in additional capital to help drive our growth we think there's some interesting m a opportunities um but we you know our balance sheet is great and we feel really good about where the business is would you consider any secondary offerings just to make the early employees happy that took equity instead of larger salaries from the early times in my role you know everything is under consideration at any point so um that's the right answer toby [Music] all right guys let's uh let's wrap up here with the famous five toby number one what's your favorite business book uh i'd say the business book that's resonated the most over the last few years for me is multipliers number two is there a ceo you're following or studying right now my latest ceo um that i've really been digging in on is jeff bezos number three is there a favorite online tool you've got for building your business besides your own uh that was tricky i saw that wonderless is like my um most favorite tool right now in terms of just managing my life which i think in turn helps me manage the company better and toby how many hours of sleep are you getting each night i'd say an average about six that's pretty good what's your situation married single kids i am married and i have three children three kids and how old are you i am 47 years old 47. all right take us home here what do you wish your 20 year old self knew uh what i would call practicing patience guys there you have it practice patience he's certainly done that launched adderall back in 2010 grew that to well north of a 300 million dollar business but before realizing wow we have a real opportunity to build a product here that's more account based marketing focused or growth focused they've rolled out role works over the past several months started with 200 customers now that product just several months in has already passed 2 million bucks in arr too early to talk about economics on that like churn cac rpo etc but we'll stay in touch with with toby toby in the meantime good luck on the growth and thanks for taking us to the top thank you nathan have a great one